Military Dog Tag / Name Tag 1st RDF

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Saki
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A recently found a "dog tag" "name tag"
1st Royal Dublin fusiliers E company 5983 T KANE
I wonder could any of you wonderful individuals shed any light on it.
Possibly Boer war or WW1
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Saffron
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FYI: A bit of background
The Royal Dublin Fusiliers was born on 1st July 1881. The 1st Battalion was created out of the old 102nd Regiment of Foot (Royal Madras Fusiliers) and the 2nd Battalion was created out of the old 103rd Regiment of Foot (Royal Bombay Fusiliers).
The regiment was garrisoned at Naas and served the counties of Dublin, Kildare, Wicklow and Carlow in Ireland.

Your T.Kane joined in late 1896 or very early 1897. As service nr 5764 joined on 19th May 1896 and 6043 joined on 24th February 1897.

By those dates I would GUESS at more likely to be Boar War than WWI.

During the Boar war the 1st Battalion sailed on the Bavarian on 10th November 1899, arrived at the Cape about the 28th, and was sent on to Durban. While the 2nd battalion was in South Africa when war was declared.

Masses of information here about the Royal Dublin Fusiliers in the Boar War (this is a great site for Boar War research)
https://www.angloboerwar.com/unit-infor ... -fusiliers

There was a "T.Kane" in the 2nd battalion (information from the QSA and KSA medal rolls), but unfortunately no service nr or other details so this might or might not be the man the dog tag belonged to.

Evan

QSA = Queen's South Africa Medal - awarded to military personnel who served in the Boer War in South Africa between 11th October 1899 and 31st May 1902.
KSA = King's South Africa Medal - This second campaign medal for the South African or ‘Boer War’ was instituted in 1902, for award to all those who were in theatre on or after the 1st January 1902, and had completed 18 months service in the conflict prior to 1st June 1902.
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Saki
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Appreciate that Evan.
Getting closer to T Kane and his family :thumbsup:
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I notice that the dogtag is 1st Btn, but the only T.Kane R.D.F. record for the Boar War was 2nd Btn. That does not eliminate this man; as from the beginning of December 1899 to 3rd March 1900 A, B, and C companies of the 1st Battalion were attached to the 2nd Battalion and men could move between companies.
(Edit: But the service number that was later found did!)

Evan
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Lovely to see you’ve been out detecting Saki :D

Nice badge and beautifully researched by Evan, our resident genius army researcher :Star:
Yes I really don’t like Roman coins, I’m not joking
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With WWI you have the draft records which give details of the persons address, DOB, next of kin.
Sadly for the Boar War there are no such records.
So to progress you need a lot of luck, and I think what I have posted is all that is likely to be found.
But I think that there is a good chance that the T.Kane that the dogtag belonged to is the same T.Kane that was awarded the QSA and KSA medals (Edit: Subsequently found to be a different man :pulling hair out: )

Evan
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Oxgirl wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 11:53 pm Lovely to see you’ve been out detecting Saki :D

Nice badge and beautifully researched by Evan, our resident genius army researcher :Star:
The lockdown kinda scuppered my brain when it comes to detecting. And this stupid thing called WORK just got in the way.. :thumbsup:
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Saffron wrote: Fri Jun 25, 2021 12:10 am With WWI you have the draft records which give details of the persons address, DOB, next of kin.
Sadly for the Boar War there are no such records.
So to progress you need a lot of luck, and I think what I have posted is all that is likely to be found.
But I think that there is a good chance that the T.Kane that the dogtag belonged to is the same T.Kane that was awarded the QSA and / or KSA medals

Evan
Evan, THANK YOU :thumbsup: :D
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This is the SS Bavarian, which the 1st RDF sailed to South Africa on.

The ss Bavarian was a twin screw 10376 ton steam ship built by William Denny & Brothers, Dumbarton, and launched in 1899. She was the first ship of the Allan Line's 20th-century fleet. She only made one trip to Canada before being Commisioned into war service

Above taken from the following sites which contain more information.
https://www.internationalstory.gla.ac.u ... ion/?id=40
https://www.wrecksite.eu/wreck.aspx?165936


This details the journey of the 1st RDF to South Africa, and is taken from http://www.norwayheritage.com/p_ship.asp?sh=bavar (which looks really useful for this type of research)

October 1899 : Chartered by the Admiralty to convery troops to the Cape. Became Boer War transport #16
Nov. 8: Departed Liverpool for Queenstown with officers and men for the Boer War
Nov. 10: Departed Queenstown with about 60 officers and about 2000 men for the Boer War. She also carried a lot of equipment and explosives
Nov. 28: Arrived Cape Town from Las Palmas (called at Las Palmas Nov. 15).Atlantic Journey ID 10637
Nov. 28: Departed Cape Town For Durban. Atlantic Journey ID 10638
Dec. 1: arrived at Durban

Evan
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I have just been looking at the Royal Dublin Fusiliers website https://royaldublinfusiliers.com/

This gives much more information about the QSA and KSA medals than the other sites that I have used, eg rank and service nr.
The T.Kane that was awarded both the QSA and KSA medals was a "Kane T. Pte 4927 2nd Batt" so is a different, and earlier, service number to our T.Kane.

The RDF QSA and KSA medals rolls lists most of service numbers around 5983, but not 5983.

So it looks as if our man did not go to South Africa after all


Sorry Saki about the wild goose chase, but unfortunately it can happen when you do not have sufficent information (some thing as simple as just the service nr for the QSA & KSA on the sites I used would have avoided it!).

Well at least I gave a bit of background about the RDF, and what our T.Kane's friends in the unit did.

Evan
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Can`t say i have seen one of these Pre Great War, so that is an interesting find, Saki.
As usual superb research by Evan.
Cheers, :thumbsup:
Dave.
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GOT HIM :Party: :Party: :Party: :Party:

He is Thomas Kane, and was born and lived in Mountmellick. Mountmellick is in northern County Laois, which was at that time was known as Queen's County, in the province of Leinster, Ireland

He signed up at Naas, County Kildare, on 1st January 1897 aged 18, (so was born about 1879) and was already serving in the Leinster Militia and was working as a labourer. He was 5' 5 3/4", weighed 118lbs and had blue eyes.

His parents were Thomas and Bridget Kane, he had a 2 brothers Patrick and Andrew and a sister Margaret, and they lived in Maryborough.

On 4th May 1898 there was a Court Of Enquiry at Aldershot about how he sustained a injury to his ankle on 18 April for which he was still in hospital, they accepted that it was an accident. He had previously been in hospital with a "sprained ankle" from 19 - 31 January 1898. There was a statement from the surgeon that this would effect his efficiency as a soldier. He was Discharge "Medically Unfit" on 3rd October 1898, probably due to his ankle injuries.

Evan
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Saffron wrote: Fri Jun 25, 2021 4:14 pm GOT HIM :Party: :Party: :Party: :Party:


On 4th May 1898 there was a Court Of Enquiry at Aldershot about how he sustained a injury to his ankle on 18 April for which he was still in hospital, they accepted that it was an accident. He had previously been in hospital with a "sprained ankle" from 19 - 31 January 1898. There was a statement from the surgeon that this would effect his efficiency as a soldier. He was Discharge "Medically Unfit" on 3rd October 1898, probably due to his ankle injuries.

Evan
Were they implying he did it on purpose to get out of the army, or did they consider it might have been done to him? Intrigued :D

Thanks Evan :thumbsup:
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Saffron wrote: Fri Jun 25, 2021 4:14 pm GOT HIM :Party: :Party: :Party: :Party:

He is Thomas Kane, and was born and lived in Mountmellick. Mountmellick is in northern County Laois, which was at that time was known as Queen's County, in the province of Leinster, Ireland

He signed up at Naas, County Kildare, on 1st January 1897 aged 18, (so was born about 1879) and was already serving in the Leinster Militia and was working as a labourer. He was 5' 5 3/4", weighed 118lbs and had blue eyes.

His parents were Thomas and Bridget Kane, he had a 2 brothers Patrick and Andrew and a sister Margaret, and they lived in Maryborough.

On 4th May 1898 there was a Court Of Enquiry at Aldershot about how he sustained a injury to his ankle on 18 April for which he was still in hospital, they accepted that it was an accident. He had previously been in hospital with a "sprained ankle" from 19 - 31 January 1898. There was a statement from the surgeon that this would effect his efficiency as a soldier. He was Discharge "Medically Unfit" on 3rd October 1898, probably due to his ankle injuries.

Evan

Evan, you are an absolute legend. A legend I tell you
Fantastic and unbelievable research.
This was found in Portlaoise. Not far from where he was born.

Evan, THANK YOU, THANK YOU, THANK YOU
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Oxgirl wrote: Fri Jun 25, 2021 5:49 pm Were they implying he did it on purpose to get out of the army, or did they consider it might have been done to him? Intrigued :D

Thanks Evan :thumbsup:
My understanding is that if a soldier was hospitalised a Court Of Enquiry was held to establish the facts, so I do not think that anything should be read into this.

Obviously establishing the cause of the injury was a primary objective-
a) "did he do it on purpose to get out of the army".
b) "it might have been done to him".
c) was it the result of negligence by himself or others.
d) was it a genuine simple accident.

If found to be a, b or c, court martials could result.

Other factors are also important. Most signiicantly if the injury occured "On Duty" or "off duty" .... if the injury resulted in the man having to leave the army this would effect his pension (it would be higher if "On Duty"). It could also effect his pay.

There was a Court Of Enquiry after both injuries, and both injuries were on the same ankle. In both cases the enquiry found that the injury occured on duty, and "Half hospital stoppages" were approved.

The first occured when route marching near Frimley and his foot "turned under me on the road and my ankle was sprained" and he came back to barracks by ambulance wagon.
While the second was while participating in a gymnastics class at Aldershot.

The first injury must have been serious as it resulted in hospitalisation from 19 -31 Jan 1898, and even at this stage the medical surgeon said "It may possibly interfere with his future efficiency as a soldier".
With the second injury to the same ankle on 18 April resulting in him still being in hospital to at least 5 May again it must have been serious and again the same comment was made by the medical surgeon.
The conclusion of this second enquiry was that "the injury was as a result of an accident on duty and beyond his control".
So after 2 cases of hospitalisation due to injuries to the same ankle its probably not surprising that he was discharged "Medically unfit" latter that year.

So it looks as if there was nothing suspicious about the events and that he just had a weak ankle that did not stand up to the rigours of army training.

Evan
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