The big machine debate - does there have to be a winner?

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Oxgirl
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What I honestly don’t get is why there has to be a winner in the battle of the machines debate. I do think some machines are weaker at the bottom end, and don’t agree that if you walk over a target every machine will find every target (sorry but they won’t) but why does this need to be an emotive discussion, where making digs at another machine is necessary?

I’m not talking specifically about current conversation on this forum but more generally. When the Nox came out I was interested and watched as it did perform brilliantly on some sites and specifically on some targets. Did I feel the need to slag it off? No.
So if I thought it was better in some ways ways why didn’t I buy one? You could say I was a fool but actually my machine was just the right one for me and I’m happy with it. It’s strengths are right for my land, my detecting style and my preferred targets. In fact I’d also go one step further and say I’m content with my detector - the nirvana state for any detectorist. I’ve reached that on land too because always looking over the hedge made me miserable. I now no longer look at the next field and think that’ll be better either. It makes for a much more enjoyable hobby as envy and jealousy and ‘what ifs’ just lead to anger and frustration.

So my question is why is there a need to criticise other people’s machines? I’m interested in honest answers.

Some forums don’t allow debate on different machines but we think it’s important. Like cars there are looks, functionality and performance differences between makes and models and understanding those improves the chances of getting the right one for us within our budget. I just don’t get the point of the negativity :roll: . Interestingly it never happens on the women’s only FB group so is this a macho thing like you see in football or something else?
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jcmaloney
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All machines have their strengths and weaknesses. Thats it.

The most important, in fact vital part, is the nut on the handle.

That nut needs to understand the machine, understand what does what - all these "expert settings" make no difference if you don`t know why they are there. Equally every bit of land has a different fingerprint to work with in terms of soil make up and background noise.

The other reality is that if you miss a target by an inch you might as well be in the next field. :thumbsup:
I`m Marmite me. Opinionated, obstinate and somewhat tenacious.
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Oxgirl
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jcmaloney wrote: Wed Oct 27, 2021 10:47 am All machines have their strengths and weaknesses. Thats it.

The most important, in fact vital part, is the nut on the handle.

That nut needs to understand the machine, understand what does what - all these "expert settings" make no difference if you don`t know why they are there. Equally every bit of land has a different fingerprint to work with in terms of soil make up and background noise.

The other reality is that if you miss a target by an inch you might as well be in the next field. :thumbsup:
That doesn’t answer the question though does it? :D
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the-roman
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It seems to me that if some people pay over £1000 for a machine then they have to justify it by making out it's the best thing ever and nothing can match it. Likewise when a new machine comes onto the market there are some people who have to have the latest and can only justify it by slagging off older machines. I have seen them and heard them in the field time and time again. It's nothing new, like some people have to have the latest mobile phones. I am not knocking any new machine at all, neither do I want to discredit any make or model. People will also always recommend the machine they use, even if they have never owned a machine that someone else is talking about. Just human nature really.
I personally have no need or incentive to 'upgrade' my detector which I know how to use very well and does me proud. I am always interested in new machines and like to hear about them and how they perform, but I do not rush out and buy one just because someone on youtube does a video comparing machines and making out that this one or that one is by far the best, as in my experience, it's just not true.
There is no big secret to detecting. A decent detector, know your detector and what it's telling you, walking over the target, being on a good productive site with plenty of history and plenty of luck is all you need. In my opinion anyway :thumbsup:
mattjb
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It's an interesting question and not easy to answer!
I look in and sometimes post on a few different forums apart from this one,fishing and football usually. The same sort of thing goes on in all of them when it comes to debates.Just different personalities ,some people have the I'm always right attitude ,some are just wind up merchants.The what I've got is best view.
Some get a kick out of belittling others opinions.Its much more extreme on other forums than on here,I'd say the people on here are more polite to each other and more helpful.
You may be right about it being more of a macho thing.
Personally , in life I just look at what I've got and whether I'm happy with it ,not what others have got and respect others opinions
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Charles Abbeyville
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Naturally, it would be really good if there was such a machine as 'the best' machine and with honest appraisal and plenty of time it might be possible but then, on what kind of ground?
If you play about with ANY machine you can actually still miss targets like hammered. Another machine might sweep over it and get it but... if you had set your machine up properly, after experimenting with programmes and settings you wouldn't have missed that hammered and you would then think that next machine was better than yours.
What a bloomin minefield eh?
So, we all know the mantra, "buy cheap buy twice" so let's get that one out of the way. Buy a quality detector, preferably one that folk you know have recommended, the adverts are not always honest!! (Who knew that :roll: )
Then, don't rush on to the land and begin detecting with your new wonder lollipop, do some experiments, lots of them. Once you have done that you will have at least gained confidence that this works better than that.
It took me :cry: about two years to get full confidence in my Deus and even then, recently I discovered a new setting, only a slight twitch but yet another step towards nirvana.
So which machine is the winner? Probably the one you are swinging. :thumbsup:
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shaggybfc
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I have no real brand loyalty - I invested in XP as an upgrade - (Pre Nox), as I liked the simplicity of the design - light and wireless. When the hype was all about the ML Equinox, I was interested, and considered buying one, but being a tight old git, I couldn't justify the additional spend. I had a play around with one for an hour, and didn't really like it - I know it was only an hour, and it wasn't enought time to appreciate it, but that was enough for me.
Wide crack banter removed.
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Steve_JT
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The key is being happy and confidant in the settings and whatever your swinging, no need to slag off other for their choice in machine make so everyone's a winner, anyone who has a real beef about a brand is obviously not perhaps a happy bunny generally

It was the same with cars, often all the bad rumours were started by competitor car manufacturers, one example was Ford cars were difficult starters, I have had lots of Fords never had a bad starter amongst them.

If there was truly one best of the best that's all there would be, you would end up with a mediocre product because they have the market, competition is great , it makes manufacturers compete to make a machine to beat its rivals, but all have their strength and weaknesses WHATEVER MAKE

So to answer the question.........NO, there doesn't have to be a winner

Regards Steve
A foolish faith in authority, is the worst enemy of truth." Albert Einstein
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TheFenTiger
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Problem is there is a fine line between banter and bullying and I don't mean just within detecting or this forum but generally. What one person considers to be harmless fun is not always interpreted the same way by those on the receiving end. Especially if they are not the type of person who feels they can reply, or if they do, it starts to escalate beyond reasonable bounds. Nearly always the person who thinks banter is fun is the one giving it out.

Amount of times I have heard "its only a bit of friendly banter" or "they should be able to take a bit of banter" when people have got upset, walked away, left forums or facebook groups. Might be fine with your mates down the pub but on the internet you never know who in on the other side of the screen or the effects it could be having on them.
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Personally i have no interest in brands or materialism.
When i buy something, i keep it until it falls apart and is no longer useable.
Therefore i have no opinions on which detectors others use and would certainly never criticise anyone or big up my machine.
May well be that i have one of the cheapest detectors on here, had it 5 years and never considered upgrading it, which would be financially impossible.
Although i have not found Hammereds and my finds are probably low key run of the mill, with the odd exception, my detector gives me a few hours respite, once a week from the treadmill that is life. May not even fully understand how it works, basically a switch on and go but that is how i like stuff.
Everyone is different and the members of forums, will be the same as every work place in the country and like the characters on a TV show all different. You will always get the look what i have type but there is no need to belittle someone or indeed their detector. There are two types of people in detecting, those with a genuine love of History, who learn from what they and indeed others find and learn from the research in trying to identify something. Then there seem to be the more numerous get rich quick merchants, who little do they realise, it will never happen. Luckily there do not appear to be any of the latter on the TDH.
Tried my best, Cath to answer your question but very easy to go off on a tangent.
All the best, :thumbsup:
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Oxgirl wrote: Wed Oct 27, 2021 10:40 amI just don’t get the point of the negativity :roll: . Interestingly it never happens on the women’s only FB group so is this a macho thing like you see in football or something else?
How sexist! :D
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TheFenTiger wrote: Wed Oct 27, 2021 2:22 pm Problem is there is a fine line between banter and bullying and I don't mean just within detecting or this forum but generally. What one person considers to be harmless fun is not always interpreted the same way by those on the receiving end. Especially if they are not the type of person who feels they can reply, or if they do, it starts to escalate beyond reasonable bounds. Nearly always the person who thinks banter is fun is the one giving it out.

Amount of times I have heard "its only a bit of friendly banter" or "they should be able to take a bit of banter" when people have got upset, walked away, left forums or facebook groups. Might be fine with your mates down the pub but on the internet you never know who in on the other side of the screen or the effects it could be having on them.
Totally agree with everything you say, as i have been on the receiving end of it for no reason in the work place, just because an ex manager wanted to look good in front of management.
Cheers, :thumbsup:
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Oxgirl
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TheFenTiger wrote: Wed Oct 27, 2021 2:22 pm

Amount of times I have heard "its only a bit of friendly banter" or "they should be able to take a bit of banter" when people have got upset, walked away, left forums or facebook groups. Might be fine with your mates down the pub but on the internet you never know who in on the other side of the screen or the effects it could be having on them.
Agree completely :thumbsup: I find that that those justifications are completely untrue in most cases - it’s back tracking because they’ve been called out. I’m all for a bit of ribbing of each other but there’s an obvious difference when it’s a solid poke at someone/ something else.

I guess we all like to know we’ve bought well, especially if it’s a recent purchase. Also, whilst I’m not going to throw money at any old new machine, I can afford to buy a new one if I want one but not everyone can. I can feel the frustration from some people who can’t afford it and feel left out and aggrieved as they have no choice when they’d like to ‘upgrade’. I get both of those situations. I just don’t get the need to comment on other machines on forums/ facebook groups just to make a negative comment.

Maybe it’s just a reflection of society more generally. Not seeing and interacting physically with others means we don’t get the honest feedback we all sometimes need to rein it in, adjust the language and tone or see a different side to a set viewpoint.
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shaggybfc wrote: Wed Oct 27, 2021 1:16 pm ....
Wide crack banter removed.
Hey I saw that! :o :lol:
A bit of banter is good between friends, but guess some not used to our sense of humour would not quite see it that way and otherwise get upset? :? :angel:
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Oxgirl wrote: Wed Oct 27, 2021 10:40 am Does there have to be a winner?
The only thing that matters is that you are happy with your detector and it suits you. All detectors have varying qualities and some are better in certain conditions than others so their is no single overall winner, each is just what it is and no more and no less but it's always interesting to discuss them.
Personally I can only go by my own experience of using different detectors which may be different to that of some others but it's not an exact science due to variables. Only real life comparisons between detectors over the very same targets in the same test conditions are meaningful. :thumbsup:
Oxgirl wrote: Wed Oct 27, 2021 10:40 am Why is there a need to criticise other people’s machines?"
I wasn't aware that there was a need but guess I could try if I must! :lol:
I don't personally see any criticisms as such as I only use this forum, unless you are counting a bit of banter or discussion which I don't think you are referring to. But I guess that those who bought say a poor detector on a whim could get quite defensive and make spurious claims or crirticise in attempt to perhaps defend their bad choice? Or maybe those who have doubts about their own or their detectors ability feel the urge to criticise others? Perhaps brand loyal steadfasts? I just don't know? But if someone is genuinely quite happy with their detector of choice then there is no good reason for them to get upset if someone criticises it especially if someone is just stating proven fact. There is no reason why the cheapest and worst detector couldn't make a better chance find than the most expensive one, though that alone doesn't mean that either are any good. :thumbsup:
My detector is crap but it's still better than yours! :shock: :rollinglaughing:
Not really, my detector is the dogs dangly bits! :D
I guess yours is probably okay too if you like that sort of thing! :wink: :thumbsup:
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